I relate to so much of what you said, Denise.

I actually refer to the way I dress as "goth librarian". My tendency to dress conservatively (despite a ragingly liberal mindset) comes from that I used to weigh about a hundred pounds more than I do now. I was a classic geek when I was in school--overweight, glasses, braces quiet, smart and too intimidated not to refuse giving my work away for copying, reading during recess. Even my friends saw me that way, up until graduation. Even when I sometimes bluntly mentioned that I was into this or that, whether foreign films or altering one's consciousness or good ol' sex, no one paid any attention.

When I got to get away from all that, I became much more like I always wanted to be, and felt like I should be--at home, with years of fear and expectations, I still wore poorly-fitted clothes, didn't talk much, etc. So at college I started wearing stuff I'd always wanted to wear. I got some piercings. I began wearing makeup. I began trying to talk to people (even though I could add zippo to the sports banter and talk of The OC and the like).

I made some friends, but it still sucked when no one wanted to date me... so I went online, too. Being 18 on a website--no matter what you might say on your profile--will garner way more email than you know what to do with. Furthermore, most of the men were in their thirties or forties, so it wasn't like I could very feasibly date them longterm. But, being game, I met some and learned about a lot of things I'd always wondered about. It always made me laugh to myself knowing I had just had totally kinky sex the night before, which no one would ever expect.

That was always the issue for me--no one thought there was any more going on with me. Even when I now dress much more interestingly, and look a lot better--and have a little confidence, by and large people don't expect me to have anything original to say. Or that I'm interested in all the stuff I am--if I was a geek once, it meant that I was the person to copy the Latin from and don't get caught hanging out with me; if I am "one of those goth chicks", it means all I'm good for is "freaky" sex and amusing bitter atheist jokes.

I mean, come on. I think most people can't really understand others who are more dimensional than they are.

I think the way people see me is entirely my own fault. I dress random. One day I'll be dressing in black and totally goth looking or another day I'll dress way cute with florals and pinks. That's me though because I like so many things I can't set myself to a particular genre. It confuses people entirely, but I actually like this quality because then I can prove to people one does not have to like just one thing.

I am also a huge fan of everything fantasy, especially faeries. My room is like this and even webpages such as Myspace are spruced up with fantasy. What is interesting though most people precieve me as this hippie girl who believes in faeries and spirits and the supernatural when really I don't believe in any of it. I'm actually athiest and have no set religion. And when I tell people this they ask "How can you not believe if you love these things so much?" I simply don't believe for certain reasons but why do people care so much if I believe or not?

I've tried dating online twice both times it just put my emotions down the drain. They never worked. I'm hoping to find someone in the real world. It's so easy to get trapped in the whole internet thing because it's easier to talk to someone online but in reality it's just terrifying. Most guys who ask me out online I don't even find attractive, and all they want is sex anyway. And like you said denise since they can't get what they want out of really hot chicks they come to us who seem more vulnerable. But really they don't know what they are in for.

I was young when I dated these boys and have learned valuable lessons from it so if I were to ever date online again I would be a little more smart about it.

Jenna :)

I don't have a lot of time just at the moment, but find this a fantastic topic. Will write more soon!

well, I have long hair that I wear back professionally at work but can be wavy when drumming all night around a bonfire...

I wear suits to work but would rather wear sarongs to dance or drum in...

yeah, many wonder about the other me when I discuss sweat lodges and nights of drumming till sunrise... but I know will never see

I enjoy the challenge of saying hire me for my resume not what you think about my looks... and am always surprised when they see a drummer can talk... LOL

reality is what you make it and I am multi-faceted!!!

Lobo

What a great query! I have what my daughter refers to a 2 lives. To those people that are not in my group of "dance" friends..I guess I am viewed as kind of pretty...shy..and sort of quiet. But, it seems that once I get into a bellydance costume ...well, let's just say views visibly change! It's actually quite funny to see peoples reactions.....I am a great observer of attitudes! When I was newly single and performing almost nightly...I thought, well....I might meet someone...maybe. The truth was men were either too intimidated to even have a conversation....or...they thought that bellydancer meant prostitute.....had to set THEM straight. It's too bad that outward appearance is what we are immediatly judged by. And women......the vicious. catiness that is rampant in the dance community AND in society in general makes me sick. Everyone professes to be "sisters"...what a joke!!! I try to look past appearance...but a conversation that I had yesterday put me in my place. My daughter asked "what if you found a guy that liked all the same things that you do...but he was ugly...would you date him?" I thought for a minute before replying "just HOW ugly?" SHAME ON ME!!!!!! I guess that I'm not as compssionate as I profess to be .....huh?

This is an interesting topic... as well as one that interests me personally, as a student of humanity, relationships and how we interact.

Denise, all, I hope you'll forgive the lengthy commentary that's brewing in my mind...

I have spent most of my life as a "master chameleon," as I was taught that paradigm as a child. I was raised by parents who traveled extensively, and we visited many countries and cultures. As part of that experience (for the first [roughly] 20 years of my life), the lesson was "when in Rome." There was a two-fold purpose to this: One, courtesy and politeness demanded that we adopt local mores and customs; two, there was an element of personal safety in "blending into the woodwork" in places where foreigners "westerners") were perhaps not welcomed.

Taken "in context," most people would look at the above and declare that it "makes sense." And I agree with that. However, if we change the "context" and regard this upbringing from the perspective of childhood/youth being training for adult life, there's a problem-- namely that I was raised with a very flimsy sense of self, given that "self" revolved around an ability to change to fit whatever environment I was presented with.

In the context of the present discussion, most of my first 15-20 years of "relationship history" (I am 46) was shaped by a tendency for "me" to be a "moving target," able to "become" whatever was needed in any given moment... while having no real sense of myself.

My parental models for the meaning of "relationship" was also filled with conflict. My father was "looks obsessed," while my mother (a former runway model in New York) endlessly PREACHED how important it was to consider what was on the INSIDE of a person (their heart, their soul, their character), while ASKING (as the first question) anytime I expressed interest in a girl/woman whether she was "slim, fit and pretty."

Hard to say, given all that, where "appearance" and "reality" began and ended....

Like Denise, I spent more than a decade in "mis-match" work situations, trying to be what was "expected" of me... mostly by family and environmental peer pressure... as a quiet, unassuming introvert in fields (Sales, marketing, advertising) dominated by aggressive, forceful outgoing people. I got really good at "faking extraversion," while living with an inner conflict between pretty much loathing my life, while also trying to persuade myself that this was "the good life."

At some point, in my early- to mid-30's, my life sortof collapsed, and (with the helped of a very insightful therapist) I found myself contemplating what "me" really meant. I suppose it "helped" that I found myself in the throes of AvPD (Avoidant Personality Disorder, a severe form of Social Anxiety) so I had lots of time by myself, to think about myself, and my life.

My observation, a dozen-odd years later (at it's an "observation," not necessarily a "fact"), is that a very large part of our relationship struggles are rooted in the fact that we have poorly defined senses of self. We *think* we know who we are, yet if we dismantle this thing called our "personality," we often find that "we" are merely a collection of external soundbytes that sounded "cool" at the moment we encountered them, or they served some "purpose" that wasn't necessarily a true reflection of "us." By extension, we look for (in others) additional "soundbytes" that aren't necessarily a reflection of our own truth. In the most basic sense, they are (albeit FAR more subtle) variations of choosing someone (like we/may not have done in High School) because they "have a cool car."

These days, my "reality" and my "appearance" are almost identical. I have abandoned my previous need to appear more "successful" than I am in favor of the truth that I am-- and expect I always will be-- a sort of "creative slacker." I no longer measure "success" by what I "have" but by how I feel-- do I feel content? I don't go in pursuit of friends because I am "supposed to" have lots of friends. Yadda, yadda, etc., etc.

But it's a work in progress. I am by no means "perfect," nor any kind of "expert" on anything. I focus on "being me," and that's either going to be cool with people, or not cool. I have come to accept that (if I am LUCKY) that MAYBE one-in-100 people whose path crosses mine will be on the same wavelength as I. And that's OK. I am learning to treasure what I HAVE, rather than lament what I DON'T have.

I suppose if there's a chasm I struggle with, it is being an "intuitive-feeling" male in a society that sees male characteristics as being "logical-thinking." Some part of me longs to have male friends who don't perceive "me" as "soft"... while I also find myself saddened by the number of wonderful women who can't really see beyond me "platonically," since I don't embody conventional "Alpha male" characteristics. Whereas it is nice and flattering to be nominated as "honorary girlfriend," it's also a fact that most women don't sleep with their girlfriends.... But I remind myself that I am making a choice based on my TRUTH, rather than illusions or masks.

As I wrote (in part) in a different post, "myself" is probably expressed best in writing, followed by one-on-one. The "competing energy" of groups quickly wears me down, and the larger the group, the more I fade into the woodwork and become less a true expression of myself. I am not competitive, and I don't want to have to "fight" to get a word in, and be heard. So maybe that IS a true reflection of "me-ness."

Namaste,
Peter